Oh the embarrassment ...

Things we've done as SeneGence distributors, that we are now ashamed of.

• “I helped hand out snacks at my husband's work Christmas party, with the sole goal of being able to talk to the younger women there about LipSense. And it clearly made them uncomfortable. But yet I persisted 😬. And felt so guilty afterwards.”

• “The most embarrassing thing was when I got caught up in buying things to grab people’s attention to ask about LipSense. Buying lipstick- or lip-themed everything and wearing stripes on my hand.”

• “I did a party at a friend's house, and forced myself to say give the 'SeneGence Choice' spiel (just buy stuff, sign up as a customer, or sign up as a distributor), and it felt so awkward.”

• ”Running a give-away at a party, to be drawn at the end of the month — solely to get people's contact details. I did give away a prize to one of them, and she was not chosen at random, but as someone who I thought was most likely to keep ordering from me, or to hold a party. She didn't.”

• Gone 'wowing' at the shopping mall, approached sales assistants and random women in the lifts and bathrooms, and showed off how the LipSense stripes on our hands don't smudge off. And tried to get their contact details.

• Sat through training sessions where the whole focus is on recruiting, and nodded at the trainer, and wrote down notes, promising to try harder.

• Ordered hundreds of dollars of LipSense and other products without really thinking about it, bowed to the pressure to have the newest stuff, and more stuff. Impulse buying. And not telling our partners. Hiding the costs.

Email us if you want to share a few embarrassing moments here, anonymously: crownlessprincesses@protonmail.com

#LipSense #SeneGence #embarrassed #MLM #antiMLMmovement #cult #influence

Top photo by Dmitry Ratushny on Unsplash

I signed up for SeneGence around February 2017, right in the thick of the Out Of Stock (OOS) Apocalypse. I signed up under a local woman I befriended. I’d been wanting to help my husband out a bit by taking the financial load off his shoulders and possibly “going back to school” with some online courses. I was excited at first. I paid my $55 (ie over $60 after S&H and taxes), joined every Facebook distributor group I could, listened to my upline for guidance and listened to and observed from other distributors because I was the new kid and they obviously knew more than I did about how these things run, right?

When I signed up, my upline kind of but not really made me aware of how dire OSS was. She flashed me her phone, showed me all the stuff that was OSS, but reassured me that there was plenty of LipSense to get me started with, and I needed to order right away. Order business cards. Order packaging. Start a group. Plan a party. Indiscriminately add friends to it because if they wanted to leave and not support me, they would, and friends that wanted to see me succeed would stick around.

Recruit recruit recruit. Sell sell sell. Party party party.

(Even as I’m writing my blood is boiling to think of how I got suckered into this mess, despite being such a cautious person.)

I listened to her because I thought we were friends. I listened to the group chatter when things were really bad and NOTHING was in stock but skin care products no one cared about because all we’re ever told is “Our lipstick is the best and it sells itself”. Hint: it doesn’t sell itself.

I continued to listen. I continued to front load when I had no money to do it with. Another reason I started this was to help with debts, not add to them! But over and over again I read “front load” from uplines that we as newbies are supposed to be able to trust and look to for guidance. I read so many stay positive, God’s got this type things. I’m a follower, but I have a hard time believing God is in something that felt so off for me.

This went on for months. I’d feel discouraged about why I did this in the first place and I’d consult with my upline, she’d give me a generic pep talk and ask a lot of questions about why I started this to begin with, building a business, etc. All I wanted to do was pay some bills and maybe further my education! Not build an empire!

Over time I realized how I’d been used. That alone made me mad, but what made me even angrier is that I didn’t even see it coming.

There’s two kinds of distributors: ones that just sell product, and ones that sell possibilities. The ones that sell possibilities build big teams, get big commissions off those big teams, and give them the cheery pep talks when there’s an impending mutiny because nothing is in stock. Those are the ones who were sickengly positive all the time, discouraging any sort of questioning the situation and squashing it as “negativity” and “if you aren’t succeeding, you aren’t working hard enough” which is utter and total bullshit. I realized it too late after I’d spent hundreds if not a few thousand trying to stick it out, keep positive, and “girl boss” my way out of a bad situation.

It’s so easy to fall for the tactics. I really do like the lipstick but the pitches I was advised to give to sell product never felt genuine. I felt like I was misleading everyone when I tried to sell a whole overpriced kit when you don’t even really need the remover (it tastes awful anyway), or to act super pumped for a product that I hated or didn’t work (looking at you, mascara and lip volumizer).

I lasted about four months before I jumped ship. I was not happy doing this business. I wasn’t excited. I was super jaded about the company and their shadiness, their misleading methods of selling product, the distributors chugging that SeneBlue Kool-Aid and trying to get others to shut up and chug it, too. I got so sick of it all and was really depressed for a while because I felt like a failure.

I sold off what I could in a final going out of business (GOOB) sale, and sent the rest back to the company. I got reimbursed, not fully, but enough. I feel burned by someone I trusted, too. I really felt like she knew how bad it was and glossed over it to get me to sign up. She was really convincing and reassuring, and I totally fell for it like a complete sucker. I doubt she’s going to pay me for my extra leftovers I gave her, too.

I know not everyone’s experience was like mine. I should have known better, should have trusted my gut about this company and MLMs, but I was pulled in by playing to my best intentions.

Moral of the story: if it doesn’t make you happy to do, don’t do it. And don’t fall for pushy sales tactics, no matter who they’re coming from.

I will never, ever do an MLM again. I’d sell a kidney if I needed money that badly.

— Jaded And Not Blue

#SeneGence #LipSense #frontloading #outofstock #cult #MLM #antiMLMmovement #truestory

Photo by Tyler McRobert on Unsplash

It really looks like SeneGence distributors are quitting in droves, and the numbers of orders are dropping, given this ever-so-slightly panicked and bullying post by a Crown Princess.

We're frankly aghast that she's telling her vast downline that to be very successful, they have to order 750 PV every month. NO EXCEPTIONS. (This isn't a requirement from SeneGence, by the way, it's her own speshul rule.)

Do you know how much a 750PV (points value) order costs? It's a lot. Hundreds and hundreds of whichever currency you're working in. In the USA, it's just over $1,000.

It also buys you a shitload of stock. If you were only buying LipSense, that would be 60 tubes of the stuff. SIXTY. TUBES. EVERY. MONTH.

So, who is this REALLY benefitting? Sure as hell ain't our CP's downline. Unless they have a large number of customers, with new ones coming in constantly (cos let's face it, even the keenest customers don't need new cosmetics every month), they're only going to be stockpiling & front loading at a great rate.

They'll end up in debt, and having to offload stock at low prices. That wouldn't happen, would it? Oh wait ... how many 'LipSense Buy/Sell/Trade' groups are there on Facebook? Yeah, we've lost count too 🙄

The ones who are brave enough to voice any concerns about how they can't afford it are told “If money's the issue, then there is no issue.” Get out there and sell stock. And the only reason they can't sell stock is because they told themselves they couldn't. The Secret and Attraction Marketing are big things in SeneGence. The 'science' of these is completely debunked, but as we know, bad science never stopped them before.

But as long as the Cwown Pwincess gets her huge monthly commission payout, does she really care at all about the financial burden she's putting on her downline? We doubt it.

#SeneGence #LipSense #frontloading #bullying #cult #CrownPrincesses #downline

SeneGence does love to just give us percentages, instead of round numbers of distributors. And you know, it's really very easy to come up with numbers, given the total number of distributors, and the percentages they provide (2,000 is 1% of 200,000, after all).

So, here's our version of the 'American distributors map' (as of October 2017), with round numbers of distributors, instead of percentages.

Percentages converted to numbers of distributors

This is SeneGence's percentages map.

And as a 'heat map' ...

The general New England region seems to be a bit more immune to SeneGence than other areas, which is intriguing. 🤔

Other numbers, for the record: Australia has just tipped over to 6,000 distributors.

What we would really love to know, however, is what's the churn rate? How many distributors are leaving, as well as the number who are joining, and totals? I doubt we will ever know.

#SeneGence #scam #cult #distributors #USA #LipSense #MLM #Australia

There are a host of bad science graphics that do the rounds of LipSense circles periodically. Even when we question our ‘higher ups’ about these, and point out the logical fallacies, and just plain old incorrect biology, they say things like “It’s product knowledge shared from SeneGence headquarters.” Which means it must be absolutely true. Apparently.

But they’re saying things like:

• New skin cells are rushed to the surface of the skin! (Umm) • Wax builds up on the lips from chapsticks and other lipsticks! (Nooo) • Bags under the eyes are caused by the tear ducts pooling (Huh?) • Dark circles under the eyes are caused by blood leaking out from weak capillaries (WTF)

These things are obviously complete rubbish. I won’t even dignify them with refuting them. Although, if you want to know what causes dark circles under the eyes (spoiler alert, it ain't 'leaking capillaries') — visit this page. The sciency gals over at Nerdy for my SeneSisters do a great job of debunking these claims, and we take our Crownless hats off to them.

But it beggars belief when you point out to a Crown Princess that maybe the graphic she’s just posted in her group is not true, and the instant response is “It’s from SeneGence.” And that’s the end of the conversation.

Here’s a tip: you’re only making yourself look incredibly stupid by putting out these sorts of graphics, having blind faith that the people at headquarters know what they’re talking about.

#senegence #debunked #badscience #waxbuildup #cult #MLM

I was introduced to LipSense about a year ago, by a young friend. At last! Truly long-lasting lipstick, that really stayed put. Heaps of great colours. I was in love! And after a few months of thinking about it, I signed up.

I tried to do due diligence. I scoured the web for critical reports about SeneGence. At that time, there weren't any (now there are, and this blog is part of that drive to educate). I read the Policies and Procedures guide carefully (but without a whole lot of understanding about MLMs). I've never liked MLMs, so I was very leery about signing up. But it looked like a bit of fun, if nothing else.

My upline was awesome, but also new to the business, so we were both stumbling about learning how to do it all. She never hassled me to place orders, and was very supportive.

It was easy to get caught up in the excitement of buying all the testers, whee! And orders arriving several times a week was fun. I cautiously got involved in the various Facebook groups. I found the other distributors were mostly younger women, seemingly kind-hearted.

I really loved LipSense, and it wasn't hard to be enthusiastic about it with my friends and family. I gradually grew a customer base, and greatly enjoyed getting together with them to do demos, mostly in small groups. I ran a few parties. I wore my stripes. I spoke to random women at the shops. I went to distributor trainings. I even got a couple of downlines, and spent heaps of time helping them, happily.

I spent a lot of money on printing all the various things — business cards, flyers with colour charts, 'how to apply' cards — and the various bits and pieces — packaging supplies, envelopes, mirrors, disposable tester sticks, gifts for customers and hostesses, and so on. Paid far too much for the crappiest website on earth. SeneGence supplied nothing, really, except for a shitty, badly written book by Joni (which I threw into recycling, after reading a few chapters), and a bunch of DVDs. You really have a large outlay to get everything you need for the business set-up. In no way is the 'only $55 to start your own business' an accurate estimation of costs!

I was always wary of the corporate culture and cult-ish nature of the company's communications and more senior upline discussions on Facebook. I avoided the annual 'conference' Seminar. All those tiaras and sashes, for starters ... all the 'rah rah rah go team' stuff freaks me out 😖

Inevitably, I ran into compliance issues after a few months. This made me realise that no, it's not really your own business. You can do 'whatever you like', as long as they let you. You can't discount more than 15%. You can't decant small samples of the skin care into sample pots for your customers. You can't remove the awful packaging labels. And heaven help you if you want to ask slightly probing or critical questions in one of the Crown Princess (CP) groups. Attack by the mob.

I have run my own business for many many years, and do know how to work hard and how to make a small business work.

I have had plenty of sales, and very happy customers, but am still several thousands in debt. If I can sell my remaining stock, I'll be lucky to break even. And I was working hard at it, putting in several hours a day on the business (in addition to my other work). I still love LipSense, and some of the other cosmetics. Not sold on the skin care. I won't be renewing my distributorship when it rolls around.

Here's a list of my main grievances with this company, and the reasons I'm quitting:

• The 'royalty' scheme for advancement is frankly offensive to most modern women. I guess there's a subset of women who want to be the 'prom queen', but it's setting actual female empowerment back by 50 years. And this really doesn't translate well to other countries (I'm not based in the USA). If you want to reward us, give us actual tangible rewards, like improved earnings — not shitty plastic 'gems' from China, or tiaras and sashes. It's just insulting.

• 'Pay to play' is not cool, guys. To be paid your downline's commission, you have to place an order that month as well. Sailing very close to the P word (pyramid) definition, there.

• Inventory rubbish. This is just bollocks. Cut half the colours, with no warning. Panic buying en masse, when we can actually get anything. Then suddenly they 'find' some in our local warehouse. What, were they hidden under the bed? They know damn well how much stock they have of everything (or else they don't, and that's just as bad). My guess is they're keeping stock of discontinued colours in reserve, and then releasing it a little at a time, to generate panic buying. Don't forget, we distributors are the customers keeping SeneGence running, not our customers.

• Not stopping recruitment during the worst of the Out of Stock dramas. It's simply unethical to continue signing up distributors when there's nothing for them to sell. Firstly, this tells you that SeneGence is making a lot of money from sign-up fees alone. And secondly, do I need to mention the 'P' word again? Taking sign-ups with nothing for them to sell is text book pyramid scheme. A CP told me they wouldn't halt recruitment because they 'didn't want to hurt our businesses' — bollocks. Hurt their business, more like it.

• All their packaging and publications are just embarrassing. The post below on branding nails it. I'm too embarrassed by how it all looks to be able to sell it, especially the skin care range. I removed all the labels from my testers (ha!) — they look lovely now.

• I suspect lies. Many many lies. Where's the proof of the 'warehouse break-in'? 'Red pigment shortage'? Really? I found no mention of it anywhere, in industry sources. (Although I did find mention of red pigments recently becoming more expensive worldwide 🤔.) Skin care is their top seller? In nearly a year, I've sold one skin care product (and not for want of trying). All my customers want is LipSense, and some of the other cosmetics. I suspect that if they really do sell a lot of it, it's to distributors only, who get it to hit their monthly PV (points value) amount, because it's so frigging expensive.

• Plain old stupidity. Crap 'science facts' being promoted, showing a true failure in education (the gals over at Nerdy for my SeneSisters are doing a great job of fighting back against the tide of stupid.)

• Being pushed to front load (buy lots of inventory) because you can't 'sell from an empty wagon'. The official Policies and Procedures document says that they don't encourage front loading, because that's what they need to say legally to avoid being called a pyramid scheme. On every order, we have to tick a box certifying that we've 'sold 70% of our previous order'. Which very few of us have done. Again, they're covering their arses. It also means that they can limit how much unsold stock they refund you for, if you quit and want to send stuff back. Cos you've 'legally verified' that you've sold 70% of everything, haven't you! Even if you've got thousands in stock piled up.

• Communication by Chinese Whispers via the CP groups. 'He said, she said' sort of garbled messages, with various interpretations and confusion. Amateurish (like so much of this company).

• The bullying culture in the Facebook groups for distributors. Mean girls abound. Distributors ratting on each other, as 'compliance police'. It's fine if you just Like and Love everything, and don't push back on anything. But want to discuss anything? Have some criticisms? Nope. It's like the worst aspects of high school, all over again. Who needs that?

• The language used by the Princesses and Queens and such. I find the use of unearned endearments like hun, bae and babe are demeaning. When I come to an upline with a problem, the last thing I need is a dismissive 'positive whitewash' answer, hun. Lack of empathy — what's so hard about saying 'Yeah, that sucks, I'm sorry that's happened.' No, everything has to have a positive spin. It's an effective way to stifle discussion.

• The cultish manipulation of language and social interactions. Lots has been written about this, and SeneGence does it. This article is just one. Just one relevant quote from this article:

Another thought-stopper is the exhortation to “think positive” and to not think about the negatives. According to the motivational speakers and other scamsters who push this nonsense, thinking positively makes us happy and fulfilled, and magically improves our lives.

This is a quote from the ManaGence manual (for more senior distributors):

Building a Positive Attitude Maintaining a positive attitude through the up and downs in your business and in your private life takes work. Build a positive attitude by starting each day with an inspirational thought, book or tape. Stay connected to positive people and never share a negative thought with your Downline team.

• The Christian aspect is a huge turn off for me. At least this isn't so noticeable outside of the USA.

• The fact that Joni's husband Bennie/SeneGence's Chief Strategist was the biggest donor to Trump's inauguration fund in Oklahoma was the absolute final nail in my SeneGence coffin. He donated $250,000. $250,000 😱

These are just my main problems with this company. I've got more. My experiences have only reinforced my original view of MLMs. Never again.

By the way — thanks for ruining royal blue for me, too 🙄.

— Distributor 3

#lipsense #cult #debunked #senegence #warning